Graphics card

[csy]

It depends if your integrated video chip is adequate or not. If your outputing to a SDTV (720x480-NTSC or 720x576-PAL display resolutions) then the integrated 6150 and X300 video chips are satisfactory, but any other chip generally provides jerky/studdering motion and blurry/soft edges. If you have a HDTV or computer monitor then all integrated video chips are inadequate.

Based on the above statement, if your integrated video chip is inadequate, then a mid/high-end AGP/PCIE video card is the way to go. Which card to choose is dependant on your display device and desired display resolution.

PCI video cards don't support DXVA (MPEG2 hardware acceleration) and don't support hardware de-interlacing (used to provide sharper picture), therefore its only advantage would be to provide smoother motion if you are currently suffering jerky/studdering motion.

Edit:
For some strange reason this post is showing as the first post, but should actually be post#2 following Hpoeflickering post. Daylight saving adjustment may have mixed-up the order of the posts.

[hopeflickering]

Right now im using an intergrated video chip that's on my MOBO as an output to my monitor to view videos. If i beefed it up, to say, 128MB PCI video card, will this improve performance/video quality?

[wabashtrail]

First Timer - Thanks to all, especially CSY for detailed info

CSY-
After reading one of your posts, I purchased the Drop Amp EDA 2100 to raw CRTs. Dual splitter(-3.5db x 2) was too much, so I changed back to the original 3 way (-3.5db modem; 2 x -7db CRTs).
In the future, when I connect to the TV tuner, I will test the dual again and check for best results.
No issues with modem return path, and the video quality is Amazing - Thanks.

TV Tuner:
I went with the ATI TV Wonder Elite(550), since it is supported, stable and has remote. However, since it is Unopened and NIB, I might resell on Ebay and go for the 650 or an HD tuner.
Current Config: Cable > CRT
Post PVR: Cable > Digital Box > PC > HDTV
Any thoughts?

Ok, Video Card?
I will be upgrading to HDTV, and since this is for media center and not gaming, I would like your opinion for:
nvidia 7300GT quiet. Pipelines 8, 400MHz but good reviews.
And
7600GT with fan. Pipelines 12, 1400MHz noise, heat.
De-Interlacing for HD and CRT. Specs here.
Is the 7300 subpar for HD with PureVideo?
I don't want to skimp or waste money on a noisy card with features I may not need.

[stefan]

This table is pretty good to see what feature you didn't know you wanted

http://www.nvidia.com/page/purevideo_support.html

[csy]

Hi wabashtrail,

I have recently been having an interesting time trying to find a sutiable video card for my HDTV (30" LCD with 1280x768 native resolution).

My minimum requirement is VMR9 rendering, hardware de-interlacing, and renderer based aspect ratio correction (ie video decoder specifies aspect ratio to renderer, and not using GBPVR auto-aspect mode).

The combination of those 3 features in combination with 1280x768 resolution appears to be very demanding on the video card, and I've found you need a high-spec video card.

Starting with my original ATI 9550SE, - continuous freezing and only 5 frames/sec

ATI 9600XT - bad studdering, but fine at 1024x768

ATI 9800Pro (8 pipelines, 256bit, 21.7GB/s), - same as 9600XT, indicating that the problem relates to a pipeline restriction or some other bandwidth issue, but not necessarily GPU horsepower.

Nvidia 7600GS (12 pipelines, 128bit, 12.8GB/s), - almost works ok but has occassional studder with rapid screen movements. I was very disapointed because the picture lost sharpness compared to the ATI cards (everything appears very slightly out of focus). I suspect this is due to poor scaling on the 7600GS. Additionally I found it messed-up the gamma and no matter how hard I tried to adjust the gamma correction, I couldn't get it right. I also found the Nvidia drivers to be very flakey, and the 90 series driver has overly complicated and duplicated video adjustments. I have also had a previous bad experience with a 6600GT, and now put-off Nvida permanently.

I have just purchased a Gigabyte X1650 passive cooled video card, and am in the process of installing it now.

Well that is my experence on finding a suitable video card for my HDTV.

With respect to the 2 cards that you are looking at, I expect the 7600GT to work well on HDTV, and this is the minimum spec recommended by Nvidia for their new HD beta driver. I think you should also be able to make the 7300GT work on a HDTV, however you will have to compromise a feature to make it work (eg not use decoder/render based aspect ratio correction and instead rely on GBPVR auto-aspect mode, or not use VMR9).

[stefan]

I have the 7600GT and it... well, it works (even though I have a hard time setting it to the correct resolution, but I think that is a problem with the combination of video card and tv set...)

[wabashtrail]

Csy-
Thanks for the feedback, and I’m sorry to hear about your HD problems.
I’m actually quite surprised.
From many of your posts, I assumed that Nvidia with PureVideo was the ultimate HD card - decoder setup.
In fact, I was leaning towards the 7600GT or higher with the built in edit features because I thought it would prevent the very issues you are currently facing.

I’m sure you have already looked into it, but since your card does not have inverse telecine, is it possible that the added fps were cause for the stutter problems?
Additionally, with Nvidia's built in Bad Edit Correction and inverse telecine, I’m curious if a compatible higher end card would have improved or even corrected the sharpness. Guess I'm not ready to give up on nvidea yet.

Stefan-
Is your setup HDTV widescreen also? If so, do you ever run into problems like Csy has?

offtopic-
Have you guys worked with Nero Recode?
It’s true MPEG-4 at original movie format of 24fps. The video quality through the PC is spectacular, but it does need X-Fi.
No telecine - frame by frame crop, auto or custom – deinterlace option - letterbox strip, and video resize.

[stefan]

Nvidia 7600GS (12 pipelines, 128bit, 12.8GB/s), - almost works ok but has occassional studder with rapid screen movements. I was very disapointed because the picture lost sharpness compared to the ATI cards (everything appears very slightly out of focus). I suspect this is due to poor scaling on the 7600GS. Additionally I found it messed-up the gamma and no matter how hard I tried to adjust the gamma correction, I couldn't get it right. I also found the Nvidia drivers to be very flakey, and the 90 series driver has overly complicated and duplicated video adjustments.

Stefan-
Is your setup HDTV widescreen also? If so, do you ever run into problems like Csy has?

Yeah, it's an VideoSeven HDTV widescreen. I use VGA connection for windows desktop, and DVI for GBPVR. Regarding csy's problems: I'm no perfectionist. But sure, the picture has studdered ocassionaly. I can't say the picture is blurry, but then again, I don't have another "perfect" card to compare with. And like my colleague said the other day (about speakers, so it was actually 'hear' instead of 'see' : "As long as I don't see it I won't want it"

Regarding the gamma - I couldn't say. I think it looks very similar direct output from my set top box, perhaps a little bit brighter. I get a bit washed out whites. But I haven't even bothered trying to change any of those settings.

And then the drivers. The only thing I've been tinkering with so far is trying to get the card to output 1366x768 over DVI - to no avail. I get it to do 1366x768 over RGB, but over DVI the best thing I get it to do is 720p (or 1080i for that matter, but I don't have any such content so I haven't used that setting).

offtopic-
Have you guys worked with Nero Recode?

Nope

[csy]

I’m sure you have already looked into it, but since your card does not have inverse telecine, is it possible that the added fps were cause for the stutter problems?
Additionally, with Nvidia's built in Bad Edit Correction and inverse telecine, I’m curious if a compatible higher end card would have improved or even corrected the sharpness.

I live in a PAL country so don't use telecine (24fps movies are played slightly faster at 25fps, so it's not an issue).

Have you guys worked with Nero Recode?

I use Nero Recode to convert MPEG2 recordings to Nero Digital MPEG4/AVC, but the current version doesn't support interlaced AVC, so it has to de-interlace first which it doesn't seem to do very well at. I'm waiting for CoreAVC to release their AVC transcoder.

[csy]

Well its been 4 months investigation but finally got to the bottom of my stuttering problem when you use the combination of VMR9+DXVA+'hardware-deinterlacing' at large display resolutions (1280x768).

The root cause was Powerstrip.

It appears that Windows/ATI-driver video timing is sync'ed to the video frame/field rate but Powerstrip custom timings is not. The bigger the difference between the Windows/Driver setting and Powerstrip then the bigger the stutter becomes to the point the video actually jumps.

I resolved the issue by editing/re-flashing the EDID on the LCD TV with the desired custom timings and now Windows/ATI-driver natively reads the EDID custom timing and automatically uses it without Powerstrip, and also sync's to the video frame/field rate.

The reason why my old Nvidia 7600GS worked was because I used the Nvidia driver to generate the custom timings, not Powerstrip.

Now that this stuttering issue is resolved, the ATI X1650 definately has superior picture quality than the Nvidia 7600GS and the ATI drivers are far superior (I am totally disgusted with Nvidia's flakey drivers where old versions have to be used to make it work, which inherently are missing all the latest features).

Hi wabashtrail,

I have recently been having an interesting time trying to find a sutiable video card for my HDTV (30" LCD with 1280x768 native resolution).

My minimum requirement is VMR9 rendering, hardware de-interlacing, and renderer based aspect ratio correction (ie video decoder specifies aspect ratio to renderer, and not using GBPVR auto-aspect mode).

The combination of those 3 features in combination with 1280x768 resolution appears to be very demanding on the video card, and I've found you need a high-spec video card.

Starting with my original ATI 9550SE, - continuous freezing and only 5 frames/sec

ATI 9600XT - bad studdering, but fine at 1024x768

ATI 9800Pro (8 pipelines, 256bit, 21.7GB/s), - same as 9600XT, indicating that the problem relates to a pipeline restriction or some other bandwidth issue, but not necessarily GPU horsepower.

Nvidia 7600GS (12 pipelines, 128bit, 12.8GB/s), - almost works ok but has occassional studder with rapid screen movements. I was very disapointed because the picture lost sharpness compared to the ATI cards (everything appears very slightly out of focus). I suspect this is due to poor scaling on the 7600GS. Additionally I found it messed-up the gamma and no matter how hard I tried to adjust the gamma correction, I couldn't get it right. I also found the Nvidia drivers to be very flakey, and the 90 series driver has overly complicated and duplicated video adjustments. I have also had a previous bad experience with a 6600GT, and now put-off Nvida permanently.

I have just purchased a Gigabyte X1650 passive cooled video card, and am in the process of installing it now.