LiveTV Startup Slow

[ralphy]

Startup of LiveTV seems much slower than on PVRX2. Is this normal, or is there something that be can tweaked to speed this up? Might help improve the WAF

NPVR 1.5.31

[sub]

How slow is it here? There isnt really anything that should add much time, over the startup time of the device, which cant be avoided (and should be exactly the same as PVRX2).

Here it takes about 4 seconds or so, which is pretty much what I'd expect.

If you start the live tv, then post the logs, I'll see if I can see any extra unexpected delays.

[ralphy]

I did some timing, although can't call it scientific -
PVRX2 LiveTV seems to come up in 2 to 3 seconds
NPVR is about double that - seems like 3 to five seconds, so I guess this is to be expected based on your comment.

Channel changing (channel up / down) in PVRX2 is fast - a couple of seconds (and most of that it is in the time for the STB to change channels), but NPVR is closer to four or so. (I use a composite analog input). There's also the psychological impact of NPVR being slower, because nothing happens on the screen. In PVRX2, the new channel details appear very quickly, whereas nothing appears on the NPVR screen until the new channel is displayed.

In PVRX2, this meant that one could use channel up and down to surf to the next channel, but this is no longer possible since nothing is displayed and you don't know which channel you'll end up on (unless you can count key presses and remember the channel numbers - I can't do either). Perhaps you can show the details of the new channel more quickly, whilst the tuner catches up?

I did note that the up/down arrow shows channel information and upcoming show, which can be then be selected with enter, so this may be the [better] alternative for users.

Some other off topic findings...
I copied my PVRX2 irremote.ini to NPVR, and the channel up and down seems to be reversed now, but they still map to the same page up /page down keys..

I use black background screen, so the NPVR shortcut icon only shows up as a white 'n' on the desktop (rather odd looking)

Thanks sub!

[johnsonx42]

in addition to the arrow up/down now/next mini-guide, there's also a full screen LiveTV overlay guide accessed via F1. This was enabled via a patch to 1.5.28, now standard with 1.5.31.

yes, you're right the channel up/down are mapped backwards from usual convention - channel up goes to a channel higher up on the visual guide, rather than the channel with the higher logical number which is 'normal' . they've been that way for a release or two now, I'm not sure if it's on purpose or not. at least it changes channels in order now; a release or two back the channel up/down followed the physical channel order rather than their assigned logical numbers.

I have nothing to prove it with, but it sure seems like the recent releases of NPVR start live tv and change channels a lot slower than earlier releases did. When I first tested 1.5.19 or 1.5.21 I was quite impressed with the live tv startup and channel change speed, now it seems to take forever.

[whurlston]

You probably don't have timeshift mode enabled for PVRx2. NPVR is always in timeshift mode so it takes a little extra time to buffer.

FWIW, I just recently moved my data folder to a faster drive and it cut live TV startup time in half. (maybe something to do with the speed of accessing the database).

[sub]

3-5 seconds to start up sounds about right. I doubt you'd see PVRX2 being much quicker to start than this. Maybe a half second or so difference, but not much more than that.

NPVR is about half a second slower than PVRX2 at changing channels in live preview mode, but several seconds faster than PVRX2 in timeshift mode. NPVR is in a kind of hybrid live-preview/timeshift mode, where it starts out showing your the live signal from the card, but always buffering to disk and ready to pause or skip back etc. There is lots of other advantages that come with NPVR's handling of live tv (like no dependence on PIDs found at scan time etc), which make it much more

Its unlikely these times will change much in future, since there isnt really a lot of fat that can be trimmed.

[sub]

I have nothing to prove it with, but it sure seems like the recent releases of NPVR start live tv and change channels a lot slower than earlier releases did. When I first tested 1.5.19 or 1.5.21 I was quite impressed with the live tv startup and channel change speed, now it seems to take forever.

I really dont think anything has changed on that front. Live tv has been done exactly the same way for all the 1.5.x builds, and there has be no noteable changes in those areas, so I'm sure its just a case of having got used it, and wanting more. Go try GBPVRs timeshift mode to remind yourself how much slower it could be.

[sub]

I just timed a couple of my devices.

My HVR-4400 takes me about 2.2seconds to see video from clicking 'live tv' in the main menu, and about 1 second to change channels (looks like less than a second often). I think thats pretty damn good for timeshift mode.

I tried the HVR-900H I also had here. It takes about 3 seconds to so see video from clicking 'live tv' in the main menu, and about 1.5 seconds to change channel. Still pretty damn good, when the set top boxes for the same system typically take about 2 seconds to change channels.

How long are you channel changes taking there?

[johnsonx42]

I count about 6 seconds to start livetv, though the log says it gets it done in just over 3 seconds so I guess the rest is in the decoder/render chain:

Code:

2010-09-10 00:34:05.505    [DEBUG][1]    StartLiveTV@1
2010-09-10 00:34:05.505    [DEBUG][1]    StartLiveTV@2
2010-09-10 00:34:05.505    [DEBUG][1]    StartLiveTV@3
2010-09-10 00:34:05.505    [DEBUG][1]    StartLiveTV@4
2010-09-10 00:34:06.888    [DEBUG][1]    Client got streaming handle: 5F2003F
2010-09-10 00:34:06.888    [DEBUG][1]    service type is: 1
2010-09-10 00:34:06.888    [DEBUG][1]    StartLiveTV@5
2010-09-10 00:34:06.945    [DEBUG][1]    Adding system LATM AAC decoder
2010-09-10 00:34:06.945    [ERROR][1]    Unable to find named decoder
2010-09-10 00:34:06.945    [DEBUG][1]    Adding system AC3 decoder
2010-09-10 00:34:06.945    [DEBUG][1]    about to load decoder
2010-09-10 00:34:06.956    [DEBUG][1]    added decoder to graph
2010-09-10 00:34:07.196    [DEBUG][1]    Adding system MPEG1 Layer2 decoder
2010-09-10 00:34:07.196    [DEBUG][1]    about to load decoder
2010-09-10 00:34:07.205    [DEBUG][1]    added decoder to graph
2010-09-10 00:34:07.247    [DEBUG][1]    Adding system E-AC3 decoder
2010-09-10 00:34:07.247    [ERROR][1]    Unable to find named decoder
2010-09-10 00:34:07.251    [DEBUG][1]    Adding system MPEG2 decoder
2010-09-10 00:34:07.251    [DEBUG][1]    Adding EVR renderer
2010-09-10 00:34:07.377    [DEBUG][1]    about to load decoder
2010-09-10 00:34:07.406    [DEBUG][1]    added decoder to graph
2010-09-10 00:34:07.775    [DEBUG][1]    Reference clock set to 'Default DirectSound Device'
2010-09-10 00:34:08.347    [DEBUG][1]    Playback graph running...
2010-09-10 00:34:08.347    [DEBUG][1]    Graph filter list:
2010-09-10 00:34:08.348    [DEBUG][1]     - EVR Renderer
2010-09-10 00:34:08.348    [DEBUG][1]     - NPVR PES Collector (Teletext)
2010-09-10 00:34:08.348    [DEBUG][1]     - NPVR PES Collector (DVBSubs)
2010-09-10 00:34:08.348    [DEBUG][1]     - Default DirectSound Device 0001
2010-09-10 00:34:08.348    [DEBUG][1]     - Default DirectSound Device
2010-09-10 00:34:08.348    [DEBUG][1]     - Microsoft DTV-DVD Video Decoder
2010-09-10 00:34:08.348    [DEBUG][1]     - Microsoft DTV-DVD Audio Decoder
2010-09-10 00:34:08.348    [DEBUG][1]     - AC3Filter
2010-09-10 00:34:08.348    [DEBUG][1]     - MPEG-2 Demultiplexer
2010-09-10 00:34:08.348    [DEBUG][1]     - NPVR TS Reader
2010-09-10 00:34:08.355    [DEBUG][1]    StartLiveTV@6
2010-09-10 00:34:08.355    [DEBUG][1]    StartLiveTV@6
2010-09-10 00:34:08.356    [DEBUG][1]    Now: Family Guy
2010-09-10 00:34:08.356    [DEBUG][1]    Next: Star Trek: The Next Generation
2010-09-10 00:34:08.370    [DEBUG][1]    StartLiveTV@7
2010-09-10 00:34:08.370    [DEBUG][1]    StartLiveTV@done
2010-09-10 00:34:08.388    [DEBUG][1]    GetEventCode() returned: 0x000d
2010-09-10 00:34:08.388    [DEBUG][1]    GetEventCode() returned: 0x000e
2010-09-10 00:34:08.851    [DEBUG][1]    Aspect ratio now: 16x9
2010-09-10 00:34:08.851    [DEBUG][1]    Resolution is now: 1920x1080
2010-09-10 00:34:08.851    [DEBUG][1]    GetEventCode() returned: 0x8101

Here's the NRecord side of the livetv startup:

Code:

2010-09-10 00:34:05.966    [DEBUG][12]    StartStream(6944:KTLA-DT)
2010-09-10 00:34:05.966    [DEBUG][12]    looking for capture source
2010-09-10 00:34:05.966    [DEBUG][12]    checking: Hauppauge WinTV 885 Video Capture
2010-09-10 00:34:05.966    [DEBUG][12]    enabled and present
2010-09-10 00:34:05.966    [DEBUG][12]    does not have channel
2010-09-10 00:34:05.966    [DEBUG][12]    checking: WinTV HVR-950 Capture
2010-09-10 00:34:05.966    [DEBUG][12]    enabled and present
2010-09-10 00:34:05.966    [DEBUG][12]    does not have channel
2010-09-10 00:34:05.966    [DEBUG][12]    checking: Hauppauge WinTV 885 BDA Tuner/Demod     (ATSC)
2010-09-10 00:34:05.966    [DEBUG][12]    enabled and present
2010-09-10 00:34:05.966    [DEBUG][12]    has channel
2010-09-10 00:34:05.966    [DEBUG][12]    live tv is possible
2010-09-10 00:34:05.966    [INFO][12]    DigitalRecorder.StartStream(LIVE&F:\live-KTLA-DT-5415.ts)
2010-09-10 00:34:05.966    [INFO][12]    Creating BDA graph
2010-09-10 00:34:05.974    [DEBUG][12]    Using tuner Hauppauge WinTV 885 BDA Tuner/Demod (1)
2010-09-10 00:34:05.982    [DEBUG][12]    About to auto detect capture filter
2010-09-10 00:34:05.982    [DEBUG][12]    Got capture filter.
2010-09-10 00:34:05.982    [DEBUG][12]    Added capture filter
2010-09-10 00:34:05.990    [DEBUG][12]    Connected Tuner to Capture
2010-09-10 00:34:06.005    [ERROR][12]    ConnectFilters:Failed(2)
2010-09-10 00:34:06.005    [DEBUG][12]    Graph filter list:
2010-09-10 00:34:06.005    [DEBUG][12]     - MPEG-2 Sections and Tables
2010-09-10 00:34:06.005    [DEBUG][12]     - BDA MPEG2 Transport Information Filter
2010-09-10 00:34:06.005    [DEBUG][12]     - MPEG-2 Demultiplexer
2010-09-10 00:34:06.005    [DEBUG][12]     - NPVR TS Mon
2010-09-10 00:34:06.005    [DEBUG][12]     - Capture
2010-09-10 00:34:06.005    [DEBUG][12]     - Tuner
2010-09-10 00:34:06.005    [DEBUG][12]     - Network Provider
2010-09-10 00:34:06.005    [INFO][12]    About to start BDA graph
2010-09-10 00:34:06.005    [DEBUG][12]    Starting graph...
2010-09-10 00:34:06.091    [DEBUG][12]    About to tune BDA graph:
<tuning>
  <type>ATSC</type>
  <locator>
    <physical_channel>31</physical_channel>
  </locator>
  <service_id>3</service_id>
  <tsid>293</tsid>
  <service_type>1</service_type>
</tuning>

2010-09-10 00:34:06.873    [DEBUG][12]    locked=1, present=1, strength=-10000, quality=100   (took 16ms to check)
2010-09-10 00:34:06.888    [INFO][12]    DigitalRecorder.StartStream() allocated handle: 0x3F
2010-09-10 00:34:06.888    [DEBUG][12]    Live TV handle: 0x5F2003F

I count about 4 seconds for channel changes, but the log says it's done in a little over 2:

Code:

2010-09-10 00:35:27.703    [DEBUG][1]    appcommand: 51 +(lParam: 10330000, wParam: 1903BC)
2010-09-10 00:35:28.260    [DEBUG][1]    StartLiveTV@1
2010-09-10 00:35:28.260    [DEBUG][1]    StartLiveTV@2
2010-09-10 00:35:28.260    [DEBUG][1]    StartLiveTV@3
2010-09-10 00:35:28.260    [DEBUG][1]    StartLiveTV@4
2010-09-10 00:35:29.250    [DEBUG][1]    Client got streaming handle: 5F20040
2010-09-10 00:35:29.250    [DEBUG][1]    service type is: 1
2010-09-10 00:35:29.250    [DEBUG][1]    StartLiveTV@5
2010-09-10 00:35:29.250    [DEBUG][1]    Unmapping all pids from pin Video
2010-09-10 00:35:29.251    [DEBUG][1]    Unmapping all pids from pin AC3
2010-09-10 00:35:29.925    [DEBUG][1]    StartLiveTV@6
2010-09-10 00:35:29.925    [DEBUG][1]    StartLiveTV@6
2010-09-10 00:35:29.926    [DEBUG][1]    Now: The Tonight Show With Jay Leno
2010-09-10 00:35:29.926    [DEBUG][1]    Next: Late Night With Jimmy Fallon
2010-09-10 00:35:29.936    [DEBUG][1]    StartLiveTV@7
2010-09-10 00:35:29.937    [DEBUG][1]    StartLiveTV@done
2010-09-10 00:35:29.939    [DEBUG][1]    GetEventCode() returned: 0x000e

[ralphy]

I'm getting about the same response times as johnsonx42.

And as whurlston points out, I do not use timeshift in PVRX2 which might explain why it is quicker.

I guess the other thing to watch out for is [not] powering down the drives as part of power management.