Duplicating channels over DVB-S and DVB-T

[imilne]

Short version of my question: can I tune in (eg) BBC1 from both Freeview and Freesat tuners and have it seen as the same channel by gbpvr?


Long version...

I have 3x DVB-T (UK Freeview) tuners and 2x DVB-S (Freesat) tuners.

I've been running happily for months with all the Freeview channels tuned in, but only those channels that are exclusive to Freesat (BBC HD, France 24, etc) tuned in. In other words, all the channels that are available on both Freeview and Freesat are only tuned into my DVB-T tuners.

This is fine (and provides more than enough coverage for anything we need to record), but changing channels when gbpvr needs to jump between tuners slows things down. If I go Freeview->Freeview->Freeview (or Freesat->Freesat->Freesat) I get two speedy changes in each case, but as soon as it needs to do Freeview->Freesat (or vice versa) there's a noticeable delay.

One solution would be to order all the channels so that all the Freeview ones are first, then have all the Freesat ones. But that won't keep the wife happy

So my question is this... I assume I can tune in the missing duplicate channels and still have gbpvr realise they are the same channel, even though they're attached to different tuners with different EPG sources? So, for example, "BBC1" can exist across all five tuners? Then I can set whichever tuner has the majority of channels (probably a Freesat one) to be the Live TV tuner, and minimize the number of timers a cross-tuner jump needs to be made.

Is it simply enough for the channel names to be the same? If Freeview used "ITV2+1" and Freesat used "ITV2 +1" for example, they would be seen as different channels surely?

My Freeview channels get their EPG data over the air, but the Freesat ones come from an xmltv file (although it comes from another program that grabs it from the sat transmissions before saving to xml). I can post-process this to rename channels to match if need be.

Finally, assuming this is possible, and it does all work, which set of EPG data would get displayed? I think most of the time the guides are identical anyway, but if they did differ, which one would be shown? I'd guess at whichever one was imported second?

I do foresee a couple of issues with such a setup: a) it's going to be more hassle setting up tuners. b) if a channel is still ok on a live DVB-S tuner, but has changed frequency on a DVB-T tuner used for recordings (which does happen from time to time), then I'm probably only going to notice when attempting to play back a recording that hasn't worked. (Edit) oh and c) I'll get a crapper picture on ITV (if I use Freesat for Live TV rather than Freeview) but I never watch it anyway. Or are there other Freeview and Freesat channels that are worse on one than the other?

[martint123]

From my earlier experiments the first bit works fine - using exactly the same name for the channel on dvb-t and -s. However I used the same radiotimes xmltv source for all of them.

I haven't a clue as to what happens if you have two epg sources running for the same channel. It should be easy enough to try for a single test channel though. (after a good backup of course).

You can't do it for channels that are part-time on freeview and full time on satellite though.

[Pob]

Short version of my question: can I tune in (eg) BBC1 from both Freeview and Freesat tuners and have it seen as the same channel by gbpvr?

This is the normal way GBPVR should work. It does not matter what the channel is named on the sat or terrestial transmitter - all that matters is you map the correct channels to the EPG. The EPG is the lynchpin in GBPVR, and using only one EPG source it will seemlessly use any tuner be it sat or terrestial, in the priority order for live TV and recordings you set in config. Using two EPG sources really complicates things! Much easier to use just one that includes all or most of the channels, like radio times or the MS one (I forget the name) for all the tuners. With two EPG sources, wouldn't you have two entries in the TV guide for channels like BBC1? That is the way MS Media center works - yuck!

[steeb]

imilne,

if I've understood all of your requirements correctly then completely agree with previous posts. Mixing of EPG sources (OTA and .xml processed) is probably not the best way to go.

If you opt for one or the other for all your EPG needs then this I think will be a start to getting your solution. (Having said that I haven't done OTA EPG for ages so have probably forgotten exactly how it all works!). Am sure someone will correct me for being forgetful

My that's alot of cards you've got!!!

Cheers

Steeb

[imilne]

I've yet to try this yet, but thanks for the comments so far.

imilne,
if I've understood all of your requirements correctly then completely agree with previous posts. Mixing of EPG sources (OTA and .xml processed) is probably not the best way to go.

Time will tell :-)

I do have a mix now, but the channel selection per source is obviously unique.

However, even when considering just the DVB-T tuners, I only actually set one of them up as the EPG (over air) source - the other two, after being setup, get left with their EPG source as "None". (This is so it doesn't spend 6 minutes per tuner retrieving the same listings 3 times over).

gbpvr seems perfectly happy with this, and still knows that a channel exists across all three sources. I guess the question is: is this because they have the same name, or because they were *originally* set up from the same EPG.

If you opt for one or the other for all your EPG needs then this I think will be a start to getting your solution. (Having said that I haven't done OTA EPG for ages so have probably forgotten exactly how it all works!). Am sure someone will correct me for being forgetful

I could (and may well) end up doing just that. My reluctance is that the over-the-air EPG data is my preferred source. The descriptions are short, and fit gbpvr's info windows properly. I've found that the data from Radio Times is often several paragraphs long for instance. Detailed yes, but messy when displayed.

My that's alot of cards you've got!!!

Heh. It's only from two physical devices though: a Pinnacle 7010ix (dual sat/terr) card and a Nova-T USB2. 5 tuners is probably 4 more than we need for all that's worth recording though ;-)

[martint123]

However, even when considering just the DVB-T tuners, I only actually set one of them up as the EPG (over air) source - the other two, after being setup, get left with their EPG source as "None". (This is so it doesn't spend 6 minutes per tuner retrieving the same listings 3 times over).

gbpvr seems perfectly happy with this, and still knows that a channel exists across all three sources. I guess the question is: is this because they have the same name, or because they were *originally* set up from the same EPG.

I hadn't thought of that - excellent, I shall change mine now.
I think the same name is the only requirement and that cam from the same EPG in teh first place I guess.

[Graham]

I've found that the data from Radio Times is often several paragraphs long for instance. Detailed yes, but messy when displayed.

I use Alibert's TV Listings / TV Recordings plugin and I think that it is the perfect solution for displaying Radio Times listings.

[steeb]

I use Alibert's TV Listings / TV Recordings plugin and I think that it is the perfect solution for displaying Radio Times listings.

Me too, I personally like the RT listings as I like all the extra detail often given on films (all the background geeky stuff!).

Steeb

[imilne]

Well, some quick testing with a limited set of channels seems to show that this works, that is, you can have the same channel across multiple tuners and EPG sources, so long as the names match.

However, now that I've got to the point where I *could* do this, I think I've convinced myself that I don't *want* to do it. It adds a nasty layer of complexity for not very much benefit.

I think in the meantime I'll follow the other advice given, and investigate the TV listings/recordings plugin that allows the RT listings to display properly.