NPVR DRM & getting started with new h/w

[WiiGame]

Hi everyone. I'm new here. I did try to find this info out here first. And I usually *way* overwrite initial help posts with every detail and totally lose the TL;DR crowd, so I'll *try* to keep it slimmer and just answer any further questions as we go along.

BACKGROUND:
I want to upgrade my existing WMC-on-Win7Home HTPC from i3-2100+HD2000 / Intel H67 / 4GB-RAM to something like Kaby Lake Pentium+HD630 / B250M / 8GB RAM. I just want it to playback 2 windows of moving video while cutting commercials via VideoReDo, converting files, and copying them away, all at the same time; is that too much to ask? I was going to keep all other h/w the same.

[Un]fortunately, just before pulling the trigger I found out Microsoft&Co are screwing us WMCers more quickly than I ever thought because now (first time in history) new hardware won't reliably run with a still supported OS, Win7+WMC (not allowing us to last until 2020). OMG, I can't say what I wish on Microsoft here without getting banned from my very first post.


GOAL:
Proof the concept that I can successfully run other software to do what MS WMC does, just as well, that can also run on Win10 if I'm going to be forced to it now. If that works and family approves, I can move to new h/w & Win10; otherwise, I guess I give-up or find older h/w to upgrade for now.

What WMC does for me today:
- allows me to play & record live Clear QAM channels via a hand-me-down Hauppauge WinTV HVR-1250 card, which still works great BTW
- allows me to play & record live cable channels (free & DRM) via a SD HomeRunHD 3ch external box with a CableCARD in it (less reliable than the internal card)
[so, when I record, I have to manually manage that there's only 1 tuner for QAM & 3 for cable; and that's fine]
- plays DVD discs in the box
- via MediaBrowser, WMC serves up & plays my backed-up unripped DVDs, recordings (TS & WTV), and VHS home movie transfers
- also allows me to do the previous three on a lesser TV via a old laptop also running WMC on Win7 configured the same

Peripherally, I also run a Hauppage Colossus from the STB & VCR, but that's not a WMC thing.

PROGRESS:
My research led me to Kodi, and then to NextPVR with SAF codecs. Through trial & error and without MS codecs (to prove it out), I got QAM to NPVR and to NPVR-Kodi plug-in to Kodi all working. I also got cable via SD HRHD-Kodi plug-in to Kodi to work, but the SD-HR won't allow recording of HR cable channels that way, so I scrapped that idea.


CURRENT POSITION:
Last night I got NPVR to work (sketchily) with QAM channels and copy free cable channels (in anticipation of going through Kodi), but HBO (and I do currently have on STB & CableCARD to WMC) won't show me even 1 frame of audio or video in NPVR, though the device status shows it's at least connected to a correct file name, the box's green light comes on, and it seems to possibly be working in the background.

I say "sketchily" b/c last night NPVR would often randomly freeze or just not respond to keyboard commands or mouse clicks until I restarted the services. I dunno about that.

Q1: Am I even approaching this whole WMC replacement correctly? I feel lost in the weeds here.

Q2: Does NPVR allow/support copy protected cable content behind the CableCARD? [I figure WMC can do it seemingly easily, so other similar products else can, too? I mean, the CableCARD already gave the "permission," right?]

Q3: I read in the NPVR Wiki one statement that NPVR supports SD-HRHD "natively" but I could find no further specifics. Does that mean I should just be treating the SD tuners exactly like the WinTV card? Or should I instead follow the SD instructions for HDHR & NPVR I found HERE? (I would trust instructions directly from NPVR more than SD's.)


I'm learning most of these TV details as I go along so, please, be gentle. Thanks!
WG

P.S. I think I'm including the correct logs here.

[sub]

Like pretty much all software that supports the HDHomeRun (other than WMC), NextPVR only supports channels marked copy-freely. It does not support copy-once or copy-never channels. The reason only WMC supports these types of protected channels is because of the large licensing and certification fees. It's not practical for freeware like NextPVR to cover these types of costs (US$100K+). It's not technically difficult, and I have in fact tested recording/watching protected channels, but the costs of doing it legally are not practical.

To record channels like HBO in NextPVR using a set top box and HDMI capture device.

[WiiGame]

I see. I never knew that. And knowing that, I would never expect that of shareware. Thank you.

So, your STB-to-capture suggestion is exactly how I do record HBO when I want to (well, not with NPVR), but my thrust here (at least one branch of it) was just being able to watch HBO on my 2 HTPCs. So I'm guessing the same expensive licensing would be required to even just display it, correct? Or is there perhaps a different, still-legal solution out there that allows display-only of copy once/never?

Or is it a correct statement to make that all CableCARD solutions fail with regard to premium channels because it hinges 100% on WMC, and only WMC, being available in the marketplace (and it's disappearing)?

At this point, I'd be perfectly happy with play/record from local QAM channels, play/record from copy freely cable channels, and play-only from cable premium/DRM channels, all in one interface (probably Kodi?). Being in the business, can you point me in a direction where I might find such a solution? Or is that simply impossible now and I should stop wasting time and just give up?

Thanks for all of your assistance!
WG

[scJohn]

I see. I never knew that. And knowing that, I would never expect that of shareware. Thank you.

So, your STB-to-capture suggestion is exactly how I do record HBO when I want to (well, not with NPVR), but my thrust here (at least one branch of it) was just being able to watch HBO on my 2 HTPCs.

Or is it a correct statement to make that all CableCARD solutions fail with regard to premium channels because it hinges 100% on WMC, and only WMC, being available in the marketplace (and it's disappearing)?

At this point, I'd be perfectly happy with play/record from local QAM channels, play/record from copy freely cable channels, and play-only from cable premium/DRM channels, all in one interface (probably Kodi?). Being in the business, can you point me in a direction where I might find such a solution? Or is that simply impossible now and I should stop wasting time and just give up?

Thanks for all of your assistance!
WG

I am giving you some other avenues to explore for HBO.

"Watch HBO on my 2 HTPC." Might want to take a look at HBONOW.com. No recording possible but you should have VOD. One could cancel the cable version of HBO and pick up HBONow.

Sound like you have a SD HomeRun Prime???? The SD View app (WIN 10 only) currently supports LIVE DRM. DRM recordings are not currently supported. The WIN 10 View app is free. You could watch HBO live but no DVR recordings. SD DVR functionality is a $$$ item.

Just food for thought.

[JavaWiz]

For the copy protected channels, if you have a STB, you can send the output (as analog) to a tuner card (I think your 1250 would work fine) for a single tuner source (i.e. record or view on one device at a time). You'd use an IR blaster connected to the STB to change channels. Your HDHR would have 3 tuners for all the non-copy protected channels.

[sub]

I'd do what JavaWiz is suggesting - HDHR for 3x non-protected channel, then set top box play either analog or HDMI capture for protected content.

[jcole998]

JavaWiz's suggestion is exactly the setup I use for protected content. The only downside is that captions are lost using the STB unless they're already being shown while recording. I use the component STB output for HD. Works great.

[WiiGame]

Thanks, everyone! I can just about consider this one complete.

To my question of "... is it a correct statement to make that all CableCARD solutions fail with regard to premium channels because it hinges 100% on WMC, and only WMC, being available in the marketplace (and it's disappearing)?"
...
I will take the "final answer" to be: Basically, yes. At least for Win7. And for Win10, the consumer has to pay additional for a DVR service in order to attempt (beyond the OS, CableCARD box/card, and CableCARD rental).

Noting that this question doesn't include a having a STB, which I do happen to still have, so I can continue to watch through WMC for now and, at worst without WMC, through ArcSoft via composite & optical cables for my PVR card. Sounds unwise to try and save $$ at this time by dumping the one STB completely (an internal goal I considered).

All that at least tells me the boundaries of what's possible today, which was one of my initial goals, so I don't go crazy "hunting snipes."


The one open sort of peripheral question is this one, in case NPVR still figures into my future of this HTPC:

Q3: I read in the NPVR Wiki one statement that NPVR supports SD-HDHR "natively" but I could find no further specifics. Does that mean I should just be treating the SD tuners exactly like the WinTV card? Or should I instead follow the SD instructions for HDHR & NPVR I found HERE? (I would trust instructions directly from NPVR more than SD's.)

[sub]

Q3: I read in the NPVR Wiki one statement that NPVR supports SD-HDHR "natively" but I could find no further specifics. Does that mean I should just be treating the SD tuners exactly like the WinTV card? Or should I instead follow the SD instructions for HDHR & NPVR I found HERE? (I would trust instructions directly from NPVR more than SD's.)

I'm not sure what more info you're looking for. Yes, NextPVR supports the HDHomeRun devices. Those setup instructions on the SiliconDust website are generally the right sort of steps you'd take.