Twinhan 1020 DVB-S Notes and questions

[dennit]

This is to make a record of some things I've learned about my Twinhan 1020a, and to ask some questions for anyone who may have answers.

I'd particularly appreciate comments on speed/usability/WAF from anyone who has more than a few hundred channels in their guide from XMLTV sources.

Here's my situation:

I've just finished lots of testing and setup of my new DVB-S card. From Ebay I have a Twinhan 1020a tuning a DishPro Twin LNBF.

My first Twinhan 1020a was bad. The second works great, but it does not supply enough power to DiSEqC switch the DP Twin LNBF reliably. I ran a second cable to the second LNBF port and connected that to an old receiver. That supplies enough power so that the GBPVR switching via the 1020 works great. I've seen discussion of an external power mod for the 1020a, or a power inserter and may look at that. If you are running this combo, I'd love to hear how well it works with DiSEqC switching for you.

On the speed issue, I'm not worried about the slow startup. It takes me about 3 minutes for guide data to populate the guide screen when pvrx2 is first executed (v 1.2.13). I'm also not worried about the time to updateEPG. That happens at night.

Scrolling in the guide happens fast. Selecting a program to record from the guide happens quickly, provided there is no other scheduled program at that time. If there is, however, GBPVR goes off to la-la land for nearly 3 minutes. Canceling a program scheduled to record takes 3 minutes.

I strongly suspect that all my testing may have corrupted my gbpvr.db, or left in it in an unexpected state - perhaps one that slows it down severely. I've added and deleted numerous sources, I've run manual SQL batch files to directly modify gbpvr.db3 and map tuning data to channel data, I've changed XMLTV source files for existing , etc. All of this could have made my install work poorly.

I'm planning to delete everything, and reinstall from scratch to get a very clean DB now that I know what I want in there, but I'd appreciate comments on speed/usability from anyone else who has hundreds of channels with 11 day guide data. If I really need to trim down the channels, I'll do that before my clean reinstall.

Thanks for any comments.

[sub]

On the speed issue, I'm not worried about the slow startup. It takes me about 3 minutes for guide data to populate the guide screen when pvrx2 is first executed (v 1.2.13). I'm also not worried about the time to updateEPG. That happens at night.

Scrolling in the guide happens fast. Selecting a program to record from the guide happens quickly, provided there is no other scheduled program at that time.

Assuming you're using schedules direct, how many channels do you have? and how many days of listings are you loading? The usual fix is log into the schedules direct lineup editor and remove channels you're not interested in, or reduce the number of days of listings you're pulling down, or a combination of both.

If there is, however, GBPVR goes off to la-la land for nearly 3 minutes. Canceling a program scheduled to record takes 3 minutes.

It shouldnt do this. Reproduce the problem, then zip and attach the logs and I'll take a look.

[dennit]

Assuming you're using schedules direct, how many channels do you have? and how many days of listings are you loading? The usual fix is log into the schedules direct lineup editor and remove channels you're not interested in, or reduce the number of days of listings you're pulling down, or a combination of both.

I'm using Whurlston's deprecated MCEPG2XMLTV. I pull 11 days. I haven't counted the channels, but I know there are more than 400, less than 1000. I've been deleting the one's I don't need so they don't appear in the XML file.

It shouldnt do this. Reproduce the problem, then zip and attach the logs and I'll take a look.

I knew you'd say this. I'll feel really guilty if you spend the time to look at my data and conclude I screwed up the db somehow with all my testing. I timed the delay once, then looked at the logs and found the same delay time immediately before a line referencing the fact that I had turned off the automatic delete of recordings when they could no longer be found (I keep many files on a network drive and sometimes it's turned off). I doubt that has anything to do with it?

I appreciate the offer to look at my logs, and I may take you up on it when things settle a bit. Last night was the first time I'd allowed UpdateEPG.bat to run. (I used the manual load of data from config before this. The day before, I deleted lots of channels I don't need, etc.

It's enough for now to know that this should not happen and that I can get the usability back. I'm going to clean things up a bit, probably try the new 1.3.x release, then if it's still happening, I'll post logs. My main problem now is that my wife has decided she loves the NASA channel and with a shuttle mission running she won't let me work on the satellite system.

Thanks for the response!

[sub]

I'm using Whurlston's deprecated MCEPG2XMLTV. I pull 11 days. I haven't counted the channels, but I know there are more than 400, less than 1000. I've been deleting the one's I don't need so they don't appear in the XML file.

I'm guessing 75% of those channels you never watch. Remove those from the lineup downloaded by MCEPG2XMLTV, and you'll remove 75% of the time. You could also reduce the listings to a week. These two changes would have it starting pretty quickly.

[dennit]

Assuming you're using schedules direct, how many channels do you have? and how many days of listings are you loading? The usual fix is log into the schedules direct lineup editor and remove channels you're not interested in, or reduce the number of days of listings you're pulling down, or a combination of both.

It shouldnt do this. Reproduce the problem, then zip and attach the logs and I'll take a look.

I have 983 channels in the EPG, but GBPVR only sees 927 (more than I expected)
I've added the logs, but here's the relevant parts:

At 17:52 I dblclick in a scheduled program to be recorded in guide. It goes off to think for 73 seconds or so.

Code:

2008-11-17 17:52:45.875    VERBOSE    [1]    tv guide render took@final: 0.012607408410986
2008-11-17 17:52:45.875    VERBOSE    [1]    TVGuide.GetRenderList() complete
2008-11-17 17:52:46.015    VERBOSE    [1]    RecordingFactory.loadSchedule()
2008-11-17 17:52:46.015    VERBOSE    [1]    getValue cached value: /settings/AutoRemoveMissingRecordings : false
2008-11-17 17:53:59.703    VERBOSE    [1]    Skinhelper loading image from file: C:\graf\GBPVR\skin2\blue\popups\..\_CoreImages\popup_button_normal.png
2008-11-17 17:53:59.703    VERBOSE    [1]    Skinhelper loading image from file: C:\graf\GBPVR\skin2\blue\popups\..\_CoreImages\popup_button_selected.png
2008-11-17 17:53:59.718    VERBOSE    [1]    TVGuide.GetRenderList()

At about 17:54, it appears and I click on update to change the schedule, and again it goes off to la-la land for 72 seconds.

Code:

2008-11-17 17:54:11.171    VERBOSE    [1]    TVGuide.GetRenderList()
2008-11-17 17:54:11.171    VERBOSE    [1]    Recieved popup callback Update
2008-11-17 17:54:11.171    VERBOSE    [1]    RecordingFactory.loadSchedule()
2008-11-17 17:54:11.171    VERBOSE    [1]    getValue cached value: /settings/AutoRemoveMissingRecordings : false
2008-11-17 17:55:23.437    VERBOSE    [1]    getValue() loading new key/value into cache: /settings/ShowTranscodeDuringSchedule
2008-11-17 17:55:23.437    VERBOSE    [1]    getValue: /settings/ShowTranscodeDuringSchedule : true
2008-11-17 17:55:23.437    VERBOSE    [1]    getValue cached value: /settings/PreShowPadding : 1
2008-11-17 17:55:23.437    VERBOSE    [1]    getValue cached value: /settings/PostShowPadding : 2

Is this delay normal? I'm trimming the number of channels and data.

Thanks for your comments.

[sub]

Is this delay normal? I'm trimming the number of channels and data

I have about 50 channels, and a week of listings. It takes about two seconds to load the TV listings in the background when the app starts, and no noticable delay scheduling recordings.

At an average of about 30 shows a day, my 50 channels * 7 days listings is about 14000 shows loaded in the background. If you have 930 channels and 11 days of listings, its about 306900 shows to load, which is significantly more. This number is probably the major factor in how long it takes to start up, but may also have a negative impact on the database performance for other operations.

As I mentioned above, try getting rid of channels you dont watch and reduce the number of days of listings and I'm sure your problems will go away.

[dennit]

I have about 50 channels, and a week of listings. It takes about two seconds to load the TV listings in the background when the app starts, and no noticable delay scheduling recordings.

At an average of about 30 shows a day, my 50 channels * 7 days listings is about 14000 shows loaded in the background. If you have 930 channels and 11 days of listings, its about 306900 shows to load, which is significantly more. This number is probably the major factor in how long it takes to start up, but may also have a negative impact on the database performance for other operations.

As I mentioned above, try getting rid of channels you dont watch and reduce the number of days of listings and I'm sure your problems will go away.

Of the 930, only 350 are enabled and there is no programme data entered for the rest. I'll remove the entries for the disabled channels and remove some of the rest that I'm not watching. Thanks for the comments.

[JohnnyC3]

I've done it. Works great now. No overheating and Diseq switching is solid for 5 different LNBs. I'm using a 24V transformer direct to the regulator on the circuit board with no problems.

JohnnyC3

[dennit]

I've done it. Works great now. No overheating and Diseq switching is solid for 5 different LNBs. I'm using a 24V transformer direct to the regulator on the circuit board with no problems.

JohnnyC3

I'm really interested in this! Please let me know exactly what mod you made. I've looked at the circuit for the PS on my 1020a and I've identified the LM317 regulator U2 on my card. It's circuit is pretty close to the attached circuit diagram. Did you disconnect pin 3 on the U2 regulator from the DC-DC upconverter and supply it with the external 24 volts, or did you leave it connected and use a diode to feed regulated power in?

I read that Twinhan directly modulates the regulator to produce the 22KHz DiSEqC signals. Under heavy load it gets so noisy that the 22 KHz DiSEqC signals are unreadable by the switch. I wasn't sure if a mod like yours would interfere with their modulation scheme. I suspect that they regulate it through the ADJ pin.

I'm feeding extra power into the LNB through a second line connected to the second port on the Twin LNBF. That works, and it also reduces heat produced by the 1020a, but it means I have to have the extra receiver always powered.

I've also read that someone burned a card when power remained on the external supply, but the computer was turned off. They put in a relay to depower the external power input to the card. Did you do anything like that?

Thanks for your info!

[dennit]

I'm really interested in this! Please let me know exactly what mod you made. I've looked at the circuit for the PS on my 1020a and I've identified the LM317 regulator U2 on my card. It's circuit is pretty close to the attached circuit diagram. Did you disconnect pin 3 on the U2 regulator from the DC-DC upconverter and supply it with the external 24 volts, or did you leave it connected and use a diode to feed regulated power in?

I'm going to answer this myself and add some info about diseqc switching of a DishPro Twin LNBF with my Twinhan 1020a.

I modified the card by disconnecting pin 3 on the U2 regulator from the DC-DC upconverter and supplying it with an external 24 volt DC supply for an old laptop. I put a switch in and a coax power socket so that I could remove the external power supply and run on the internal supply. The external power does significantly reduce heat, as compared to running with power supplied by the card, but had no other effect I could see. It did not seem to affect diseqc switching.

Here is miscellaneous useful diseqc switching info (YMMV):

Configuration 1: Twinhan direct to DishPro:
This would scan and tune with <BDATwinhanDiseqcMethod> set to 2 only when I had an auxiliary power source (old receiver) connected to the second port on the LNBF. I did not try scanning with <BDATwinhanDiseqcMethod> set to 0 or 1.

In this configuration it would tune inside GBPVR with <BDATwinhanDiseqcMethod> set to 0 both with and without the extra power cable to the second LNBF port.

Configuration 2: Twinhan to diseqc 4x1 switch
Later I added a 4x1 Chieta diseqc Heavy Duty switch from ebay. I couldn't use the old receiver extra power since all cables went to the 4x1 switch. With this config, I could not scan with <BDATwinhanDiseqcMethod> set to 0 or 2, but I could scan with <BDATwinhanDiseqcMethod> set to 1. However, I could not record inside GBPVR with <BDATwinhanDiseqcMethod> set to 1. I could tune when set this way, but not automatically record. I had to set <BDATwinhanDiseqcMethod>=0 to record and tune.

I'm running 1.2.13. I don't know why the different Twinhan tuning methods give such different results, but if you are having trouble, try changing the power supplied to the LNBF and the tuning method you use.

Dennit